Other/Mixed The Great GTG Thread

[Steve Freides]

So, it's again a success. But I now wonder:

Have I plateaued with GTG push-ups, or should I keep going? I would like to increase my RM to 50 or similar, and I really enjoy the GTG approach.

It depends on your long-term goals. 50 pushup is a strength-endurance feat, and necessarily entails not using maximum effort on each rep. Personally, the pursuit of such feats isn't something I enjoy so I stopped at 20 reps, e.g., when I was working on pullups, and did them holding a 20 lb dumbbell between my feet because I like to train at that level of effort and I thought this to be a reasonable goal for myself, which it was. Could I have gone for 25 or 30 reps with bodyweight only? I am content never to find out. Perhaps this is because I spent a couple of decades running and cycling, and in those 20 years I got enough endurance training to last me a lifetime.

To answer your question, you certainly could continue with GTG.

-S-

 

[Oscar]

I have positive GTG pushup experiences to report, and a question arising from the experience.

First, as a calibration: About 4 years ago, when teaching only online, I would give the students a 1- or 2-minute break in the middle of the Zoom hour to get their (and my) blood flowing. I would do as many push ups as I could, though not at all strictly (e.g. my elbows probably went far outward), and could do 18 or 20.

Last year, after learning the strict SF push-up standards and seeing the SF Twitter post about how to use GTG for 30 days to master push ups, I tested my push-up RM, and it was only 6. Probably I was stronger than 4 years ago, thanks to S&S KB swings (my swing has gone slowly from 16 kg to Timeless Simple [32 kg], almost exactly 50% of my BW); and the big reduction in push-up RM was probably due to adopting strict push-ups.

After 2 weeks of GTG push-ups (9 sets daily of 2, 3, or 4 reps, depending on the die roll), I retested, and my RM had doubled to 12. After 2 more weeks, it had reached 15. I called it a success but did no more push-ups.

This year, I had to stop training for several months after a concussion, and could feel myself getting weaker. Once I could train again, I tested my push-up RM, and it had dropped to 8.

I've just finished another 30 days of GTG starting from that point. After 2 weeks, the RM of 8 had risen to 16. After the latest 2 weeks, it had risen from 16 to 18.

So, it's again a success. But I now wonder:

Have I plateaued with GTG push-ups, or should I keep going? I would like to increase my RM to 50 or similar, and I really enjoy the GTG approach.

You can take your push ups to 40 or 50 doing GTG for sure. I did it in the past doing a GTG program by @mprevost, I don't remember exactly how many I achieved but it was about 40 or 50.

I personally like high reps for the push ups, they kind of flow naturally. If eventually you get bored of the high volume, you can switch to one arm push ups.

 

[Sanjoy Mahajan]

Did you adjust your reps per set after re-testing?

Two approaches that might work:
* On some days doing more than half the reps you are capable of, and on some days doing less (1/3 to 2/3).
* Sometimes including ladders, in your case probably something like 2,4,6 and 2,4,6,8 or even 2,4,6,8,10 . Or just going up in steps of 2-3 reps until your technique gets compromised. 2 ladders per day might already be enough, if doing them not GTG but in a "I go you go" tempo.

Thank you. I should have said -- I did adjust my reps after re-testing, thus midway through the 30 days. And I always used a daily die roll to adjust the fraction (1/3 with a roll of 1; 1/2 with a roll of 2, 3, or 4; and 2/3 with a roll of 5 or 6).

I will try including ladders. Would a ladder day replace replace GTG on that day, say one or two times a week? Or would a ladder replace one, or a few, of the GTG sets (say, the ninth set on "ladder day")?

 

[Bauer]

Thank you. I should have said -- I did adjust my reps after re-testing, thus midway through the 30 days. And I always used a daily die roll to adjust the fraction (1/3 with a roll of 1; 1/2 with a roll of 2, 3, or 4; and 2/3 with a roll of 5 or 6).

I will try including ladders. Would a ladder day replace replace GTG on that day, say one or two times a week? Or would a ladder replace one, or a few, of the GTG sets (say, the ninth set on "ladder day")?

Sounds great!

I think both options would work (GTG ladders or ladders in one bout). In Strong Endurance Express Pavel mentions ladders for strength endurance: Just doing ladders in an "I go you go" fashion, with a couple of (likely imaginary) people. The different idea here is, that those ladders could be regarded as interrupted sets which the body might interpret as one long set, thus facilitating strength endurance.

Maybe worth a try on some days or for some time.

 

[Sanjoy Mahajan]

It depends on your long-term goals. 50 pushup is a strength-endurance feat, and necessarily entails not using maximum effort on each rep. Personally, the pursuit of such feats isn't something I enjoy so I stopped at 20 reps, e.g., when I was working on pullups, and did them holding a 20 lb dumbbell between my feet because I like to train at that level of effort and I thought this to be a reasonable goal for myself, which it was. Could I have gone for 25 or 30 reps with bodyweight only? I am content never to find out. Perhaps this is because I spent a couple of decades running and cycling, and in those 20 years I got enough endurance training to last me a lifetime.

To answer your question, you certainly could continue with GTG.

-S-

I hadn't realized that 50 was a feat. My subconscious idea, probably got from films like Full Metal Jacket, was that if you're in shape, you can "drop and give me 50" any time (as the sargents tell the recruits too often). So, I was using 50 as a proxy for "getting in decent shape." Maybe I'll keep using GTG but scale back my goal to, say, 30.

 

[JamesH11]

Just wondering if anyone has used GtG for lower body endurance air squats, lunges etc

 

[Steve Freides]

I hadn't realized that 50 was a feat. My subconscious idea, probably got from films like Full Metal Jacket, was that if you're in shape, you can "drop and give me 50" any time (as the sargents tell the recruits too often). So, I was using 50 as a proxy for "getting in decent shape." Maybe I'll keep using GTG but scale back my goal to, say, 30.

It really does depend on what your goals are. For me, anything more than a triple is either hypertrophy training or cardio. I do sets of 5 in my training because that's something of a sweet spot in strength training, helping a little to build/maintain muscle while also helping with limit strength, and even sometimes a few 8's or 10's early on in a cycle, but forget the movies and decide what you want to accomplish for yourself.

Learning to "spread the load" by using full-body muscle tension improves safety as well as improving limit strength performance. I think that's one of the things that attracts me to strength training. I don't think I've ever well figured out how to do 50 non-reps of a strength exercise - it's some funny spot (funny only for me, perhaps) between the two extremes of tension and relaxation. I prefer to pay very close attention for a relatively short period of time, and to focus on relaxing for long periods of time, e.g., when practicing music, when taking a walk. Strength-endurance or power-endurance work in the form of short bouts interspersed with long rest periods is also OK for me, but 50 pushups is a place my life doesn't need to go because I don't wear a full metal jacket. NB: I've never seen the movie.

JMO, YMMV.

-S-

 

[bluejeff]

Would a ladder day replace replace GTG on that day, say one or two times a week? Or would a ladder replace one, or a few, of the GTG sets (say, the ninth set on "ladder day")?

I am not sure if this is info you are looking for, but another way to do ladders with GtG is to make each GtG set for that day a “rung.” That is, if your ladder was 5,7,9,11 or something, your first set of the day would be 5 reps, the next set 7 reps and so on. Just another way to get variety.

 

[Sanjoy Mahajan]

I am not sure if this is info you are looking for, but another way to do ladders with GtG is to make each GtG set for that day a “rung.” That is, if your ladder was 5,7,9,11 or something, your first set of the day would be 5 reps, the next set 7 reps and so on. Just another way to get variety.

That's a good idea. Today I started the next 4 weeks of GTG with some ladders [EDIT: fixed spelling]. Tomorrow I will try a ladder day, either like you suggest with rungs throughout the day or as 10-15 minutes for all the rungs.

 

[Sanjoy Mahajan]

That's a good idea. Today I started the next 4 weeks of GTG with some ladders [EDIT: fixed spelling]. Tomorrow I will try a ladder day, either like you suggest with rungs throughout the day or as 10-15 minutes for all the rungs.

Yesterday was the first ladder day, which I did as 10-15 minutes (it turned out to be 14 minutes) of good reps. I did "I go, you go" with my imaginary friend to pace the rests between rungs and used the talk test to pace the rests between ladders. The ladders were (one per line):
2, 4, 6, 8
2, 4, 6
2, 4 [repeated this ladder three times]
2 [repeated this "ladder" six times]

for a total of 62 reps. For comparison, a medium GtG day (die roll of 2, 3, or 4) would have been 9 sets of 9 reps, for 81 reps. It's too early to tell what the effects of a ladder day are, but it was enjoyable and not a strain.

(The 10-15 minutes was from Pavel M.'s post on push-up ladders: Barbell - Ladder program for pushups? )