Other/Mixed The Enhanced Games -- No Testing Olympics Competitor Announced

[Boris Bachmann]

I'd be curious to see what caliber of athletes that actually take up the offer. If the best of the best don't (and I'm guessing 99% won't), then the results might not be as crazy different between tested and untested as we all imagine them to be. We all know that some (or many) already take PEDs anyway. This won't change that. At all.

 

[Oscar]

Chances are decent Bolt was saucing.

Maybe he was, in a limited manner to pass the tests. So the tests are in a way a limiting factor, at least. I wonder what we'll see when these limitations are removed.

I think the results will be more extreme in other disciplines like weightlifting rather than track and field. Maybe a 200 kilo weightlifter. We'll see.

 

[watchnerd]

I'd be curious to see what caliber of athletes that actually take up the offer. If the best of the best don't (and I'm guessing 99% won't), then the results might not be as crazy different between tested and untested as we all imagine them to be. We all know that some (or many) already take PEDs anyway. This won't change that. At all.

That's why I'm so interested in the competition.

Can B+ / A- athletes beat the famous "clean" athletes (assume best skills+ best genetics + modest juicing) if juiced to the gills?

My guess, based on Crossfit, is probably "not most of the time."

 

[watchnerd]

Maybe a 200 kilo weightlifter.

That's just Lasha in the off season after a heavy meal.

 

[Boris Bachmann]

That's why I'm so interested in the competition.

Can B+ / A- athletes beat the famous "clean" athletes (assume best skills+ best genetics + modest juicing) if juiced to the gills?

My guess, based on Crossfit, is probably "not most of the time."

I agree.

 

[Benjamin Renaud]

To me, it's all about the rules.

If you want to endanger your long term health for the sake of winning, that's your body, your decision.

If you try to compete in a no-drug league and use drugs, you're a cheater.

If you compete in an 'enhanced league' and use drugs, you're not a cheater.

If you can make money as a non-cheater in a pro-PED league, this doesn't seem dishonest.

I agree with this.

Deleted the rest. Sorry didn't want to get into a conversation for which I don't have the time.

 

[bluejeff]

I'm curious as to the mental / emotional angle.

Plenty of PEDs literally improve your physical qualities, give you more endurance, increase your muscle mass, decrease recovery, etc.

I'm most familiar with the role in weightlifting. PEDs have literally "made numbers go up".

It's so effective as a pure physical enhancement they had to throw out a bunch of old medal winners and old world records because people were juiced.

What I meant was that it seems there must be something driving people to make the jump to PEDs. What makes someone want something enough that they are willing to do it?

For pro athletes, I can see it. They are already in a place where winning competitions is what makes their living. I suppose a discussion could be had about how that might look if there were somehow a way to actually prevent PED use in a federation. But that's obviously just a hypothetical.

My concern is more about non-pro athletes using PEDs, and to that end, the effect that an openly-enhanced olympics would have on that. I would hate to see a world where youth think that in order to be muscular and strong (or otherwise athletically successful), they must use some kind of PED. I already hear about it here and there. And plenty of young men in particular don't feel "manly" enough unless they look a certain way, because they are equating self-worth with big muscles and a particular physical image. I have met people who match those descriptions. Likewise, I have met people who seem to have lower self worth because they feel less-capable, or don't look "alpha" enough.

As for PEDs "literally making numbers go up," that just reinforces my previous argument for not wanting to use them. It was the PED that made the numbers go up, not the training. If you want to argue that using PEDs allows one to train more/harder/whatever, then that still means that without the drug, the numbers wouldn't have gone up. Either way, it's the drug that did it. If you couldn't do it without the drug, then it's the drug that did it, not you. Again, I'm not interested in what drugs/chemists can do. I'm interested in what people can do.

 

[silveraw]

LSD Moto GP.

Funny enough there was a recent Dr Mike video talking about how LSD could be a big performance booster for long distance running.

Also apparently it is a fantastic metabolism booster.

 

[silveraw]

Again, I'm not interested in what drugs/chemists can do. I'm interested in what people can do

Chemists are people too…

But yeah, the current social media trend of outright PED abuse in young people is not great. I do think it is a bit worse than the fake outrage about drugs we had with lance armstrong and mark mcguire. Golds Venice taking down the Arnold posters was just peak performative outrage.

 

[Boris Bachmann]

Chemists are people too…

But yeah, the current social media trend of outright PED abuse in young people is not great. I do think it is a bit worse than the fake outrage about drugs we had with lance armstrong and mark mcguire.

I have mixed feelings about Lance and Mark.

Golds Venice taking down the Arnold posters was just peak performative outrage.

What?? Over steroids?? If that's true, that's ridiculous.

 

[Hung]

I'm just going to repeat the notion I expressed in another thread about this.

I'm not convinced that making an untested olympics is going to get PEDs out of the tested olympics. If anything, we are just going to see more athletes in general using them, for better or worse.

I'm also just going to repost this instagram link. This was a really interesting take on staying and training natural. If you don't want to read the post, the gist is this:

Seeing higher performance (or mass, in the case of bodybuilding) due to PEDs has more to do with designing a better drug, not necessarily a better training program. Staying natural means you have to be more inovative with training techniques to see better results.

My personal take is that I would prefer to see athletes do more amazing things because of how they trained (or heck, even just "crazy genetics") than because they could afford a better, probably more expensive PED designed by some chemist or whatever.

personally I think atlasshurg need to stfu about gear lifting or bodybuilding. Dude not even anticipate in those sport.

 

[LukeV]

I'd be curious to see what caliber of athletes that actually take up the offer. If the best of the best don't (and I'm guessing 99% won't), then the results might not be as crazy different between tested and untested as we all imagine them to be. We all know that some (or many) already take PEDs anyway. This won't change that. At all.

It's going to be a freak show of formerly elite athletes past their prime and athletes who were never going to make it. And I expect the sporting bodies to up the ante, probably by deeming participation in Enhanced Games as a doping offence, with an automatic four year ban for the participants. So anyone with the potential to make a go of it in mainstream sport is going to think twice

 

[BillSteamshovel]

True , but considering a decent 60" TV costs about 1/3 of a decent 15" laptop I might have to go big.
Guessing you can stream through computer and project through TV?

Yes you can

1) Old fashioned way with a piece of wire connecting the two devices, send images from Laptop to TV,

2) New fangled way use a phone or a tablet to get the videos off the internet and "Cast" to the TV

Find somebody approx 10 - 17 years old and they will show you how.

 

[Steve Freides]

I have never watched what's called reality TV, but from what I know of reality TV, I don't see how having a juiced Olympics is any different. "Popular" and "good" are adjectives that can sometimes be applied to the same thing, and sometimes not.

-S-

 

[BillSteamshovel]

Is there a fine line between supplements and PEDs ? Any definitions that might help me understand the difference ?

Seems to me that supplements enhance performance too ........... if I make a super performance drink called XYZ who decides whether or not its a PED or a supplement ?

 

[John K]

Is there a fine line between supplements and PEDs ? Any definitions that might help me understand the difference ?

Seems to me that supplements enhance performance too ........... if I make a super performance drink called XYZ who decides whether or not its a PED or a supplement ?

A supplement is an addition to one’s diet, eg adding some additional macro or micro nutrient, or possibly some herbal distillation or concoction.

A drug is usually quite different from a supplement, but the exact definition can be tricky…

 

[Adachi]

so - when I was younger, a friend of mine was taking me out to eat. and we were picking up one of his friends. This friend of a friend had to stop to make a delivery. I come to find out he's a dealer of sorts for PEDs.

This was around the time of Barry Bonds and Macguire hitting all those dingers and a conversation ensued about how basically everyone's juiced and with that knowledge, I learned, that is not the only factor in who wins and loses.

Skill stands head and shoulders above PEDs. he went on to note some names of ppl he supplied who hit in the very low 0.200s to high 0.100s. at which point, I'd demurred on the idea that PEDs shouldn't be allowed.

1. they're already doing it.
2. apparently, it doesn't make a loser into a winner.

 

[Kenny Croxdale]

Seems to me that supplements enhance performance too

Interesting Point

Creatine was once prohibited by the NCAA...

"The NCAA prohibits its member schools from giving creatine and other muscle-building supplements to athletes, although it doesn't ban athletes from using it." Creatine Information | Mount Sinai - New York.

By not allow schools that could afford to provide their athletes from than schools that could afford creatine The NCAA believed they were "Leveling The Playing Field".

My Ironic Friend

A friend of mine agree with the NCAA.

The irony of that was that he was sending his kids to a private school with smaller classes and better qualified teachers rather than the Public School System was rated produced was rated as one of the lowest in student education.

Base on his view of the NCAA's stance, I should be mandated to go to the Public School rated as one of the lowest in student education.

Life Isn't Fair

This is just a fact of life in all area.

One of my favorite quotes from a Football Coach is...

"Winning Is All About Luck!"

The team lucky enough to have the best players wins.

That is why some of the consistent National College Football Teams are always at the top; they recruit the best players and coaches.

Why I Am Not A World Class Powerlifter

I didn't chose the right parents.

Rightfully so, I blame them.

 

[Kenny Croxdale]

I'm not convinced that making an untested olympics is going to get PEDs out of the tested olympics.

Tested Olympics

After The Enhanced Games were announced, the news reported that the World Anti-Doping Agency determined that approximately 40% of the Athletes had used PED at some point.

This research statistics reinforce it.

Highlights: Performance Enhancing Drugs In Sport Statistics

Performance Enhancing Drugs In Sport Statistics [Fresh Research] • Gitnux

Performance-enhancing drugs (PEDs) have a significant presence in sports, with alarming statistics to support it. From 2003 to 2008, 1-3% of tested athletes

gitnux.org

Lance Armstrong

He as well as Alex Rodrigues never tested positive.

Armstrong was stripped, as we know of his wins. Tyler Hamilton, one of Armstrong team, was busted for using. Hamilton cut a deal to minimize his legal issues. That is how Armstrong was busted.

Ironically, that should have moved the rest of the Biker up in placing, second place becoming first, etc..

However, that did not happen because the other Bikers were believed to have used PED.

Alex Rodriguez

Alex Rodriguez' PED Coach/Supplier cut a deal with the feds to minimize his legal issues. To reiterate, Rodriguez never tested positive.

Tyler Hamilton

Years ago in an news interview, Hamilton was ask if was unfair if everyone is using them.

Hamilton's reply was quite interesting.

As per Hamilton, the unfairness was that the top athletes (making the most money) could hire the best, let's call them, PED Coaches

The Lower Rated Bikers could not do that. As per Hamilton, that was where it was unfair; the "Have Not" (not enough money) from the "Haves" (with enough money).

Enhance Game
This may give the the PED Athletes place to compete.

However, I doubt that it will every completely eliminate some individuals uses in Tested Sports.

 

[watchnerd]

What I meant was that it seems there must be something driving people to make the jump to PEDs. What makes someone want something enough that they are willing to do it?

For pro athletes, I can see it. They are already in a place where winning competitions is what makes their living. I suppose a discussion could be had about how that might look if there were somehow a way to actually prevent PED use in a federation. But that's obviously just a hypothetical.

My concern is more about non-pro athletes using PEDs, and to that end, the effect that an openly-enhanced olympics would have on that. I would hate to see a world where youth think that in order to be muscular and strong (or otherwise athletically successful), they must use some kind of PED. I already hear about it here and there. And plenty of young men in particular don't feel "manly" enough unless they look a certain way, because they are equating self-worth with big muscles and a particular physical image. I have met people who match those descriptions. Likewise, I have met people who seem to have lower self worth because they feel less-capable, or don't look "alpha" enough.

As for PEDs "literally making numbers go up," that just reinforces my previous argument for not wanting to use them. It was the PED that made the numbers go up, not the training. If you want to argue that using PEDs allows one to train more/harder/whatever, then that still means that without the drug, the numbers wouldn't have gone up. Either way, it's the drug that did it. If you couldn't do it without the drug, then it's the drug that did it, not you. Again, I'm not interested in what drugs/chemists can do. I'm interested in what people can do.

Non-pro athletes are already using PEDs.

NCAA athletes and even high schoolers hoping for athletic scholarships.

Div 1 big money sports (football, basketball) are very much there.