all posts post new thread

Kettlebell Audrey Burgio - 125 reps in 6 min!

John K

Level 8 Valued Member
Certified Instructor
Audrey recently did 125 reps with a 24kg bell in 6:00…. With one hand switch!! She’s amazing to watch, and I’m really looking forward to reading her book she just came out with.

Yes I know she’s GS.

She finishes so strong too. Most of the 6 minutes she’s so casual. You can tell she’s getting fatigued at the end, but even when you listen to her breathing as she shuts off the camera she’s so in control.

 
Pretty casual about it.

I’ve never watched a KB snatch now that I think of it and watching her technique really conflicts with what I thought proper snatch technique was.

For example: her arm stays straight on the upward portion which I find strange and her heel comes up on the working side foot nearly every rep.

I don’t know much about KB snatch technique but I’m wondering if those are productive idiosyncrasies for her technique or part of the norm.
 
For example: her arm stays straight on the upward portion which I find strange and her heel comes up on the working side foot nearly every rep
Both of those are specific to GS, Strong First doesn’t teach that. I’m not sure how the heel lift helps, but I’ve practiced it and it can feel “natural.”

The arm actually decreases tension through the rep - since you aren’t pulling your elbow back, your hand, bicep, and back stay much more relaxed. I wonder if that style of snatching is where “the snatch is a swing that ends overhead” came from, versus the current method where “the snatch is a clean that ends overhead.”
 
Guys, what do you think about the technique of dropping from the top position? I mean turning the wrist instead of swinging over the top like in HS
 
I’ve never watched a KB snatch now that I think of it and watching her technique really conflicts with what I thought proper snatch technique was.
Just as one can do many different things with a barbell, so one can do many different things with a kettlebell. Or bodyweight - contrast the person who does 500 Hindu squats with the gymnast holding an Iron Cross for a few seconds.

“Proper snatch technique” will vary with the task at hand. GS is a sport.

-S-
 
Guys, what do you think about the technique of dropping from the top position? I mean turning the wrist instead of swinging over the top like in HS
That is typical in how GS snatches, it is not the same drop as how Strong First teaches. I've had good results using both styles, but when I do long sets the GS style decreases hand fatigue. The SF style I think is better for heavy weights - or at least I find it much harder to use GS style with heavy weight.
 
@John K , IMO, the StrongFirst method of snatching a kettle bell isn’t an end of an unto itself for most people.

-S-
What do you mean? What I am thinking you mean is that the way StrongFirst snatches has a purpose (get you stronger/more powerful), it isn't technique for technique's sake - but I could be reading into what you're saying what I think.
 
Strong girl. Very strong.

Imho there is a continuum of KB snatch technique and nuances that are particular to individuals that might not work well when broadly applied (and especially as the numbers, speed, and training volumes get higher). Not to get into the whole GS vs HS thing for the millionth time but, yeah, the only way to truly truly "know" is to give it a go and see if it works for you.
 
What do you mean? What I am thinking you mean is that the way StrongFirst snatches has a purpose (get you stronger/more powerful), it isn't technique for technique's sake - but I could be reading into what you're saying what I think.
Our strength has a higher purpose. That’s what I mean. I think others have said more about that already better than I can. E.g., there is no “winner” in the snatch test.

-S-
 
Our strength has a higher purpose. That’s what I mean. I think others have said more about that already better than I can. E.g., there is no “winner” in the snatch test.

-S-

Interesting. I'm not sure I had put those things together. But let me muse a bit about this topic and see if you agree, Steve.

StrongFirst techniques and movement standards are selected to guide our physical training practice so as to effectively build a stronger and more resilient human. You will get stronger in the exercise as you train it. However, getting stronger at the exercise -- heavier deadlift, heavier swings, meeting standards like Simple, Sinister, or the 5-min snatch -- is not the direct purpose of this method of training. They can serve as markers along the path to inform your progress, but the real purpose is beyond that. "Strength has a higher purpose" as a tenet of the StrongFirst code means we are training for something beyond the gym, beyond the standard, beyond the physical accomplishment. Taking care of a relative, rescuing someone in an emergency, helping out a friend, becoming a living kidney donor -- all examples of what we become more able to do through our training. Also, for any other type of physical endeavor, StrongFirst will help you build the foundation of strength upon which higher levels of performance can be built. You can be anything you want to be.... But you must be Strong First. (Of course, Pavel says it best here: Strength Has a Greater Purpose | StrongFirst) While you certainly can develop and enjoy the attainment of physical goals and accomplishments along the way, with StrongFirst, those are secondary to the goal of becoming a better human and/or building something more from your base of strength.

So with regard to snatch technique, StrongFirst's technique may not be the best one for building the ability to do a long set of heavy snatches. One could certainly make the argument that GS or kettlebell sport technique is "better" in that way. In our opinion, StrongFirst snatch technique is the one that can be best employed to develop strength, power, resiliency, and a foundation of tensile strength. With the StrongFirst method, one can certainly work towards higher abilities -- ability to snatch heavier weight, ability to do higher reps within a given amount of time, ability to snatch longer sets before switching hands, etc. But the method itself isn't, at the outset, aimed at that.

In contrast, the GS technique is developed for the sport; for competition performance in the snatch. Everything about GS is aimed at developing the ability to snatch more, heavier, and more reps in a given time period. While you certainly can develop and enjoy the attainment of other things along the way (strength, power, conditioning, enjoyment of training, etc.), with GS those are secondary to the goal of building the ability to compete effectively in the sport.

I think my last 4 years of training in the sport of weightlifting has brought me a better understanding of these different orientations. Weightlifting, like GS, is all about getting better at the sport. You can train in weightlifting and not compete... you'll still get all the benefits of training -- health, strength, etc. But the goal of every training program is to get you better at the competition lifts: barbell snatch, and barbell clean and jerk. Techniques, programs, critiques, coach development -- all aimed at the end goal of competition performance. Although there are a lot of overlaps, StrongFirst is not oriented that way.

Really, it's a subtle difference that not everyone needs to be super aware of as they train or run these programs. But it make a lot of things make more sense about why things are the way they are. Why get stronger if we're not going to compete and test ourselves? Because strength has a higher purpose. As we orient towards that, we then have a bigger reason to become strong than competition.
 
Interesting. I'm not sure I had put those things together. But let me muse a bit about this topic and see if you agree, Steve.

StrongFirst techniques and movement standards are selected to guide our physical training practice so as to effectively build a stronger and more resilient human. You will get stronger in the exercise as you train it. However, getting stronger at the exercise -- heavier deadlift, heavier swings, meeting standards like Simple, Sinister, or the 5-min snatch -- is not the direct purpose of this method of training. They can serve as markers along the path to inform your progress, but the real purpose is beyond that. "Strength has a higher purpose" as a tenet of the StrongFirst code means we are training for something beyond the gym, beyond the standard, beyond the physical accomplishment. Taking care of a relative, rescuing someone in an emergency, helping out a friend, becoming a living kidney donor -- all examples of what we become more able to do through our training. Also, for any other type of physical endeavor, StrongFirst will help you build the foundation of strength upon which higher levels of performance can be built. You can be anything you want to be.... But you must be Strong First. (Of course, Pavel says it best here: Strength Has a Greater Purpose | StrongFirst) While you certainly can develop and enjoy the attainment of physical goals and accomplishments along the way, with StrongFirst, those are secondary to the goal of becoming a better human and/or building something more from your base of strength.

So with regard to snatch technique, StrongFirst's technique may not be the best one for building the ability to do a long set of heavy snatches. One could certainly make the argument that GS or kettlebell sport technique is "better" in that way. In our opinion, StrongFirst snatch technique is the one that can be best employed to develop strength, power, resiliency, and a foundation of tensile strength. With the StrongFirst method, one can certainly work towards higher abilities -- ability to snatch heavier weight, ability to do higher reps within a given amount of time, ability to snatch longer sets before switching hands, etc. But the method itself isn't, at the outset, aimed at that.

In contrast, the GS technique is developed for the sport; for competition performance in the snatch. Everything about GS is aimed at developing the ability to snatch more, heavier, and more reps in a given time period. While you certainly can develop and enjoy the attainment of other things along the way (strength, power, conditioning, enjoyment of training, etc.), with GS those are secondary to the goal of building the ability to compete effectively in the sport.

I think my last 4 years of training in the sport of weightlifting has brought me a better understanding of these different orientations. Weightlifting, like GS, is all about getting better at the sport. You can train in weightlifting and not compete... you'll still get all the benefits of training -- health, strength, etc. But the goal of every training program is to get you better at the competition lifts: barbell snatch, and barbell clean and jerk. Techniques, programs, critiques, coach development -- all aimed at the end goal of competition performance. Although there are a lot of overlaps, StrongFirst is not oriented that way.

Really, it's a subtle difference that not everyone needs to be super aware of as they train or run these programs. But it make a lot of things make more sense about why things are the way they are. Why get stronger if we're not going to compete and test ourselves? Because strength has a higher purpose. As we orient towards that, we then have a bigger reason to become strong than competition.
I am going to say that training the sport of GS (are we still calling it that?) actually produces all of those things (“strength, power, conditioning… strength, power, resiliency, and a foundation of tensile strength”) and are requirements to be successful at it. Not to mention “strong endurance … or maybe endurance strength more accurately) I can’t find Ksenia's 190 rep 24kg set but here is a full 10 minute video of her in competition 178 reps, one hand switch 24kg KB. She does serious damage to male egos with her 32kg snatches too.

Audrey’s form reminds me of Ksenia’s, And also Denisov’s technique; he was a many time world heavy weight champion and Ksenia’s coach.
 
Last edited:
Both of those are specific to GS, Strong First doesn’t teach that. I’m not sure how the heel lift helps, but I’ve practiced it and it can feel “natural.”

The arm actually decreases tension through the rep - since you aren’t pulling your elbow back, your hand, bicep, and back stay much more relaxed. I wonder if that style of snatching is where “the snatch is a swing that ends overhead” came from, versus the current method where “the snatch is a clean that ends overhead.”
It’s not a heel lift simply for the sake of lifting the heel. It is a follow through action of the leg drive, which is on the same side as the working arm. The sport technique is not square shoulders to the front throughout and involves more torso rotation than HS snatches allow for. (it is kind of like coiling and uncoiling the “spring” off that drive/ balance leg, the heel comes up as follow through of that action) Also the modern sport snatch technique is a straight arm most of the way to the top, although this varies somewhat from athlete to athlete. the final “kick”from waist high to lockout is from displacing upper body rearwards, which has a similar effect of the elbow bend “taming the arc”that hardstyle uses vis a vis bell path and adds velocity to the bell by shifting the bodyweight rearwards (increasing the centripetal force.) Certainly the “taming the arc” cue turned the hard style snatch into a clean that ends up overhead from a swing that ends up overhead. The sport clean is also a straight arm affair…ironically “a swing that end up in the clean rack.” I much prefer the hard style clean to the sport clean…to me it actually is more efficient, simpler and less prone to error than the current sport style.
 
Last edited:
Interesting. I'm not sure I had put those things together. But let me muse a bit about this topic and see if you agree, Steve.

StrongFirst techniques and movement standards are selected to guide our physical training practice so as to effectively build a stronger and more resilient human. You will get stronger in the exercise as you train it. However, getting stronger at the exercise -- heavier deadlift, heavier swings, meeting standards like Simple, Sinister, or the 5-min snatch -- is not the direct purpose of this method of training. They can serve as markers along the path to inform your progress, but the real purpose is beyond that. "Strength has a higher purpose" as a tenet of the StrongFirst code means we are training for something beyond the gym, beyond the standard, beyond the physical accomplishment. Taking care of a relative, rescuing someone in an emergency, helping out a friend, becoming a living kidney donor -- all examples of what we become more able to do through our training. Also, for any other type of physical endeavor, StrongFirst will help you build the foundation of strength upon which higher levels of performance can be built. You can be anything you want to be.... But you must be Strong First. (Of course, Pavel says it best here: Strength Has a Greater Purpose | StrongFirst) While you certainly can develop and enjoy the attainment of physical goals and accomplishments along the way, with StrongFirst, those are secondary to the goal of becoming a better human and/or building something more from your base of strength.

So with regard to snatch technique, StrongFirst's technique may not be the best one for building the ability to do a long set of heavy snatches. One could certainly make the argument that GS or kettlebell sport technique is "better" in that way. In our opinion, StrongFirst snatch technique is the one that can be best employed to develop strength, power, resiliency, and a foundation of tensile strength. With the StrongFirst method, one can certainly work towards higher abilities -- ability to snatch heavier weight, ability to do higher reps within a given amount of time, ability to snatch longer sets before switching hands, etc. But the method itself isn't, at the outset, aimed at that.

In contrast, the GS technique is developed for the sport; for competition performance in the snatch. Everything about GS is aimed at developing the ability to snatch more, heavier, and more reps in a given time period. While you certainly can develop and enjoy the attainment of other things along the way (strength, power, conditioning, enjoyment of training, etc.), with GS those are secondary to the goal of building the ability to compete effectively in the sport.

I think my last 4 years of training in the sport of weightlifting has brought me a better understanding of these different orientations. Weightlifting, like GS, is all about getting better at the sport. You can train in weightlifting and not compete... you'll still get all the benefits of training -- health, strength, etc. But the goal of every training program is to get you better at the competition lifts: barbell snatch, and barbell clean and jerk. Techniques, programs, critiques, coach development -- all aimed at the end goal of competition performance. Although there are a lot of overlaps, StrongFirst is not oriented that way.

Really, it's a subtle difference that not everyone needs to be super aware of as they train or run these programs. But it make a lot of things make more sense about why things are the way they are. Why get stronger if we're not going to compete and test ourselves? Because strength has a higher purpose. As we orient towards that, we then have a bigger reason to become strong than competition.
@Anna C, Pavel's article you mentioned, along with several of others of his such as The Cost of Adaptation, say it very well. I cannot speak for him but, in my opinion, you have also said it very well.

One thing I recall hearing at some of the FMS events I've attended was that FMS scores typically go down in-season for professional athletes compared to their off-season FMS scores, and that seems like the right order of priorities to me. In season, a pro's performance is what matters most. I have a meet report to post later today about my participation in Saturday's USPA NJ State Championship where I'll touch more on how the kinds of things you mention manifested themselves for me.

-S-
 
Let's focus on the topic, Audrey did 125 reps in 6 minutes with a 24. I don't care what method she did. It doesn't matter. The feat itself is impressive.

I get lost with these tenets/philosophies. If you believe in it, good for you. I find it to be marketing gobblygook. It's a kettlebell, or a dumbbell or a barbell. That's it. Just pick it up.

I remember Logan Christopher doing 300 snatches in 10 minutes. Were all the reps perfect? No, but he still lifted that thing over his head 300 times. But all the Lords of the Kettlebell Keyboard were criticizing his form instead of the insane conditioning and athleticism to be able to do it.
 
GS technique is GS technique—I have a lot of respect for GS (those that train and compete etc).

I think it is facinating that the GS snatch technique has progressed into almost a "one-sided" snatch focusing the stress on one side before switching.

What I would like StrongFirst and Hard Style practioners to look at is the pacing. She is not sprinting through the reps. The pace is consistent and there is no "sprint and panic."
 
It’s not a heel lift simply for the sake of lifting the heel. It is a follow through action of the leg drive, which is on the same side as the working arm. The sport technique is not square shoulders to the front throughout and involves more torso rotation than HS snatches allow for. (it is kind of like coiling and uncoiling the “spring” off that drive/ balance leg, the heel comes up as follow through of that action) Also the modern sport snatch technique is a straight arm most of the way to the top, although this varies somewhat from athlete to athlete. the final “kick”from waist high to lockout is from displacing upper body rearwards, which has a similar effect of the elbow bend “taming the arc”that hardstyle uses vis a vis bell path and adds velocity to the bell by shifting the bodyweight rearwards (increasing the centripetal force.) Certainly the “taming the arc” cue turned the hard style snatch into a clean that ends up overhead from a swing that ends up overhead. The sport clean is also a straight arm affair…ironically “a swing that end up in the clean rack.” I much prefer the hard style clean to the sport clean…to me it actually is more efficient, simpler and less prone to error than the current sport style.
Thanks for the explanation on the heel lift! That makes a lot of sense. I "naturally" have done the upper body shift to the rear when snatching, and it was commented on at my certification - more of a "why do you do that are you afraid of the bell" and not a "you can't do that" - but wasn't ever something I spent a lot of time to try and get rid of.
 
I am going to say that training the sport of GS (are we still calling it that?) actually produces all of those things (“strength, power, conditioning… strength, power, resiliency, and a foundation of tensile strength”) and are requirements to be successful at it. Not to mention “strong endurance … or maybe endurance strength more accurately) I can’t find Ksenia's 190 rep 24kg set but here is a full 10 minute video of her in competition 178 reps, one hand switch 24kg KB. She does serious damage to male egos with her 32kg snatches too.
Absolutely. The same way weightlifting produces all those qualities (maybe minus the conditioning part, lol.. and the strong endurance). I just see it as what do you have as your beacon to aim your efforts toward -- competition performance, or being strong for a general or "higher" purpose? Day to day, it doesn't matter -- training is training and we get stronger by many methods. It just helps to understand end most effectively employ a method to know what it's guiding principles are.

I perceive StrongFirst O-Lifting is oriented the same way as the rest of StrongFirst's methods in terms of what it is trying to accomplish. I hope that it grows from a seminar to to a course or cert. Every other weightlifting / Olympic lifting course out there is aimed at competition performance as its end goal. StrongFirst is aimed at the exercises as a training method to build strength and related qualities. Just like with kettlebells and GS or hardstyle, in the process of training, you are headed in the same direction, and what you get is at least 90 - 95% overlapped with other methods. But the guiding light, or beacon that you are aiming for, is a little bit different.

But not everyone cares about all that... we just like to train, and of course appreciate impressive accomplishments however they are attained. The OP is certainly an impressive accomplishment! I follow her on Instagram and love her style.
 
I’m not sure I’m following the “strength has a greater purpose” and how it relates to the sport snatch. In my mind the principle of training for something bigger doesn’t have much at all to do with specific techniques.

But then again I’m thinking it is just a better way of saying Rip’s “strong people are more useful in general” utilitarian line.
 
Back
Top Bottom